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ORCA with UseSym: vibrations (and other properties) drawn in the wrong frame #312
Seen: ECCE 9.0.1, ORCA 6.1.1, ethanol PBE0/def2-SVP, Opt Freq with Raman, symmetry on (UseSym in the input). In the Builder's vibration panel the displacement vectors are detached from the atoms: most show as small discs away from the hydrogens, and one arrow points into an H atom.
Cause: with UseSym, ORCA moves the molecule into its own standard orientation ("symmetry-perfected Cartesians") and reports normal modes in that frame. ECCE draws them on the geometry in the input frame. Same input, final coordinates of the first carbon:
with UseSym: (-1.247853, -0.293635, 0.000000)
without: (0.027225, 0.009643, 0.027225)
Likely also affected: everything ORCA computes in its frame and ECCE draws on the geometry: MO and density surfaces, the dipole arrow, the polarisability ellipsoid.
Fix: after an ORCA job with symmetry, use ORCA's own final geometry (in ORCA's frame) for the calculation, so the geometry and every property agree; this also covers imported jobs. Add a test: a frequency run with UseSym whose displacement vectors start on the atoms. Check whether Gaussian 16's standard orientation is handled consistently.
Also check NWChem: ECCE writes geometry autosym units angstrom, so NWChem centres the molecule and, with symmetry found, may rotate it into its own frame. ECCE reads NWChem's geometry and modes from the ecce_print stream, which may keep them consistent, but this needs the same test (frequency run with symmetry, displacement vectors starting on the atoms), together with Gaussian 16's standard orientation.
Fixed in 9.1.0. ORCA with UseSym and Gaussian already gave the modes on their own geometry, which a test now measures (the longest X-H arrow lies along its bond); NWChem frequency-only runs discarded theirs and now keep it. The arrows of atoms that barely move scale down instead of showing a full-size head.
Activity
ohlincha commentedon Oct 13, 2026
Also check NWChem: ECCE writes
geometry autosym units angstrom, so NWChem centres the molecule and, with symmetry found, may rotate it into its own frame. ECCE reads NWChem's geometry and modes from theecce_printstream, which may keep them consistent, but this needs the same test (frequency run with symmetry, displacement vectors starting on the atoms), together with Gaussian 16's standard orientation.Vibration frame: NWChem frequency-only runs keep NWChem's own geometr…
Vibration arrows: below two head lengths the shaft and head shrink wi…
ohlincha commentedon Oct 14, 2026
Fixed in 9.1.0. ORCA with UseSym and Gaussian already gave the modes on their own geometry, which a test now measures (the longest X-H arrow lies along its bond); NWChem frequency-only runs discarded theirs and now keep it. The arrows of atoms that barely move scale down instead of showing a full-size head.
Gaussian 16 GEOMTRACE: one frame per step (Standard orientation, Inpu…